Re: Any serious production servers yet?

["Vlad GALU" <vladgalu@xxxxxxxxx>]

On 6/3/06, Danial Thom <danial_thom@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> --- Matthew Dillon <dillon@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> wrote:
>
> >     I couldn't have put it better myself.
> >
> >     Vis-a-vie network performance, my goal for
> > DragonFly is to have 'good'
> >     performance.  But I think it is a complete
> > waste of time to try to
> >     squeeze every last erg out of the network
> > subsystem like FreeBSD has.
> >     We aren't trying to compete with Cisco, and
> > nobody in their right mind
> >     would take a turnkey BSD or linux-based
> > system over a Cisco (or other
> >     piece of high-end networking gear) to route
> > multi-gigabits/sec of
> >     traffic.   I still think we can get close
> > to FreeBSD's rated performance,
> >     eventually, but I am not willing to create
> > a mess of hacks and crazy
> >     configuration options to turn DragonFly
> > into the ultimate ether switch
> >     when I can purchase one off the shelf for a
> > few hundred bucks.
> >
> >     I think the last time I tried to use a
> > general purpose UNIX OS as an
> >     actual 'router' was in 1994.  We used two
> > BSDi boxes (and later FreeBSD
> >     boxes) to route the two T1's that BEST
> > Internet had when we had just
> >     started up.  It was a horror, frankly.
> > Hardware bugs in the ethernet
> >     cards and even in the T1 card required a
> > lot of hacking to work around,
> >     and trying to run BGP with gated was even
> > worse.
> >
> >     Back then 'real' networking hardware was
> > bulky and expensive.  Today,
> >     though, there is no excuse.  It's cheap
> > (and even cheaper on E-Bay),
> >     and far more reliable then a general
> > purpose PC.
> >
> >     If someone is trying to route
> > multi-gigabits worth of traffic then
> >     the infrastructure is clearly important
> > enough to warrent purchasing
> >     dedicated networking gear.  If someone
> > isn't trying to go all out,
> >     then a general purpose OS might be
> > adequate, if still not as reliable.
> >
> >     So all I can say to Mr Thom in that regard
> > is: Stop trying to fit a
> >     square peg into a round hole and just buy
> > the appropriate gear for your
> >     network infrastructure needs.
> >
> >                                               -Matt
> >
> >
>
> Your caveman-like views are as troubling as they
> are entertaining. You seem to have no grasp of
> the modern world and no understanding of 'BSDs
> niche. Everything was buggy in '94, but with you
> and clowns like Paul Borman trying to do
> networking, what the hell would you expect no
> matter what you had to work with?  :)))
>
> Many, many large network appliances (load
> balancers, bandwidth managers, firewalls,
> security filters) are based on linux or BSD. The
> reason is that CISCOs and "mega-gigabit routers"
> have no extra CPU power to do things like
> filtering and shaping at a very high level. I've
> made myself many millons of $$ selling a few
> thousand network devices, which is more than
> you'll ever make having a really cool desktop OS,
> even if its better than anything else out there.
> Designing a product for fun is one thing, but if
> you want to get funding you have to produce
> something that's useful for the corporate world,
> not for a bunch of pimply-faced college kids. The
> reality of the corporate world is that even if
> DFLY is the best damned OS ever written, they
> will use windows or linux, because you can't
> staff a support center with DFLY experts. Its
> simply never going to happen. You can however get
> in as a server platform, because only a couple of
> guys have to know what they're doing.
>
> Unix as a desktop box is not even an
> afterthought. 'BSDs niche is as a network server.
> Period.
>
> You might think its a waste of time to optimize
> networking, but it seems to me you're wasting
> your time entirely if your goal is to be a little
> faster than LINUX as a desktop box. Who cares?
> FreeBSD with 1 processor is faster than linux
> with 2, but no-one used FreeBSD anyway. Nobody
> wants to use 'BSD as a desktop machine, except
> for a handful of people with a lot more time on
> their hands than the rest of us. People want to
> use 'BSD as network servers. People in the real
> world that is. Maybe thats why your not with
> FreeBSD anymore; your refusal to modernize your
> ideas to what's going on in the real world, and
> your complete lack of understanding where the
> dollars are to fund your efforts?

  I should probably be moving on the same trend the other subscribers
follow and give you a very diplomatic pat on the shoulder, but your
bluntness simply calls for more.
  Shouldn't you be out, making some millions ? You seem to be better
at it than at implanting your ideas into other people's minds.
Everything they do, and especially Matt, is pro-bono. For fun. While
their idea of having fun consists of spending a considerable amount of
hours each day writing code, yours seem to be polishing your typing
skills. Do all of us and especially yourself a favor and reconsider
your schedule.

> DT

  Dumb Troll ?

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